What is the word on Djokovic's shoulder injury? Does his serve have anything to do with it?

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Permalink Reply by Mark / The Mayor on August 22, 2011 at 5:26pm

I agree with you Tim.  When I changed my serve recently that is when my shoulder started feeling sore.  I found this bit at the Columbia Daily Tribune online about Nole but it is not very detailed;

 

Djokovic talked about feeling exhausted in Cincinnati, coming off his record fifth Masters series title in Montreal last week. He said his serving shoulder had bothered him for about the last 10 days, but he’d been able to manage the soreness and keep winning.

Yesterday, he couldn’t go on.

“There is no good loss, that’s for sure,” Djokovic. “The good thing is there’s a week, eight days to the start of the Open.

“I’m confident I can recover and be ready for the U.S. Open.”

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Permalink Reply by Tim Prapong on August 23, 2011 at 3:39pm

I played around with abbreviating my toss and reducing the amount of chest and right shoulder turn. I was getting more power because my serve windup was more linear. But I was not getting the same amount of spin, having to pull across my chest and pull my right shoulder across the inside, where it meets the chest. 

When I am lined up more fully turned with my right shoulder at least to 7 o'clock before my pinpoint step, then there is no such strain. The old school advice is to go at least to 7 o'clock, the toss thrown at 2 o'clock.

I watch Djokovic and sometimes he is at 6 o'clock. Then he has little room to hit up on the second serve. He doesn't get the leeway as does a pinpoint server who has a greater back tilt.

BTW, I saw Djokovic double fault at the BNP Paribas final against Nadal, when he had to resort to arming his serve. His toss was errant at nearly 3 o'clock. His windup was around 6 o'clock and the serve was around 88 mph as a result.

I know a former community college champion who had his rotator cuff surgery. He would pull the inside of his right shoulder back and around. Now, to prevent that pain, he makes sure to have his stance more sideways, and have his right shoulder turned from the start of the motion. He also points his chest more skywards in the middle of the motion.

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Permalink Reply by Coach Dudley on August 22, 2011 at 8:19pm

I've had brief discussions with some top teaching professionals in the area and we seem to agree, today's tennis players from top pros to juniors have different styles from the past. Some are unorthodox, or players who copy a style of a top pro. How do you teach a beginning 8 year old who wants to hit like Nadal? Young players need to be taught classic old school tennis, which is ergonomically correct for the body and joints in many ways. Perhaps as one matures and advances, they can move to a semi-western or full western grip for the forehand. Over the years how many pros have had wrist or shoulder injury as a result of technique vs how many of the old school pros from the past?

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Permalink Reply by Major Dan on August 23, 2011 at 12:17pm

"Young players need to be taught classic old school tennis, which is ergonomically correct for the body and joints in many ways" - or so you say.     what makes 'classic' strokes ergonomically correct?  or more correct than more modern strokes?     you should at least support your argument with something other than 'brief discussions' with unnamed teaching professionals.

can you cite any studies that compaer injuries and injury rates with current and old-school players?

it sounds more like you are just throwing out your bias towards the 'good old days',  not really saying anything factual.

but too bad, the tennis world isn't going back to those old days or the old racquets or the old Australian serve and volley game, etc.

I'm afraid for you that the past is, well, in the past....

  

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Permalink Reply by Tim Prapong on August 23, 2011 at 3:23pm

I recently read Laver's autobiography and was surprised to see his struggle with tennis elbow, having had to ice it every night while on tour. It is true he used more wrist than his contemporaries, especially on his forehand. I sometimes think his forehand swing path operates much like the Nadal forehand, but with the Aussie fh grip.

Teaching the Nadal forehand to an 8 year old would require imagination and conceptualization beyond what is intellectual capable of someone so young.

Nadal's forehand hit correctly is not a stroke with bad ergonomics. It does not injure the elbow or shoulder when hit correctly, with a full shoulder turn. Too many people, much less an 8 year old, try to copy it rotating from the elbow at the point of contact or without turning the lead shoulder in. 

As for the chance of injury when hitting LATE, an Eastern or continental forehand has less chance of elbow injury than a semiwestern or Western. The racquet face is not turned skyward in the slot starting from the belly button to the front left hip on an Eastern.

But the prime Western drive forehand, either Djokovic or Soderling is much more devastating than a Tsonga or Simon forehand. There is more capability of spin, arc placement, and aggression on high balls. When hit early and correctly, the Western forehand is every bit ergonomically sound as an Eastern forehand.

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Hal Wagner on August 23, 2011 at 5:10pm

As someone who grew up learning the old school strokes, and now use and teach modern technique I have to disagree somewhat Dudley. If we teach straight back and through to youngsters at first we will only have to reteach them later on. I personally would never try to teach a Nadal style forehand to juniors since I feel that stroke is unique to him,but I have no issues with teaching modern technique to beginners. 

As far as injuries to arms and shoulders, the modern game is played with so much more power, and with stiffer rackets and strings, which put greater pressure on the joints. On a personal note after switching from a classic style forehand to modern loop I have suffered from some shoulder issues. Our shoulders are not built to withstand years of tennis, swimming, baseball, volleyball, the loop and serve motion are rough on the joint. 

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